Your new album Unwanted came out in August, talk us through it! What were the main inspirations and influences behind the band’s evolution of sound that comes with this third album?
Heather: "With Unwanted, I wanted to dive into subjects that Pale Waves had never really spoken about before. I wanted to channel a lot of anger, resentment - a lot of the darker, forbidden and taboo subjects that people don’t generally like to speak about, like jealousy and vanity. It was really nice to release that. After the pandemic, we wanted to really enjoy playing live, and I think these songs have allowed us to do that.
It’s definitely more alternative than we’ve ever gone before. I wanted people to identify us as a more alternative band rather than indie pop or indie shoegaze. I hate when people refer to us as that. I get why, because at the start we had that kind of sound, but I just really don’t like when people call us that. Nothing about us, or me in general, feels like an indie band. We’re like, no, we’re not an indie band, so stop saying that. We love high fashion, things that are chic, and we now have a very strong identity, so we’re over being called indie. That’s another reason why I wanted to push into the more alt/rock world.. We wanted to explore a world we hadn’t before. We needed to for our own sanity, we just couldn't write the same record again."
"Nothing about us feels like an indie band"
Is there a song on Unwanted that you feel completely sums up the album’s themes? - If yes, what?
H: "I think ‘Jealousy’ summarises it pretty well. It’s one of the bigger songs, and it almost has this attitude, this unapologetic personality that I wanted Unwanted to have."
Do you have any specific artists you’re inspired by, both for this album and generally?
H: "Surprisingly, in this era, I wasn’t really listening to a lot of similar sounds to what we created. I was listening to a lot of folk and acoustic artists. Whereas in comparison, with the second album I was listening to a lot of 2000s and 90s era stuff, but with this one I wasn’t really listening to artists on purpose. I just wanted the freedom to do whatever and not to feel influenced much by anything. Our producer, Zakk Cervini, he has his own sound so I feel like he helped us create that identity with his expertise.
Generally though, I have a really mixed music taste. I like a lot of folk and country, classic rock, and I love musicals as well. It can go from Aerosmith to Dear Evan Hansen. I don’t really like jazz though, it’s just not my cup of tea. Maybe it will be, who knows, but right now it’s not for me."
Do you feel, with it being your third album, that you felt more comfortable to do more of what you wanted rather than what you felt you had to do?
H: "In a way, although I try not to feel pressure from people. I’ve seen a lot of people who heard the second album and then the third album and went “oh my god Pale Waves are trying to go too mainstream!” But if we wanted to go mainstream I would have a really autotuned voice and electronic runs, so if anything we’re going the other way and going more alternative - so that doesn’t make sense. And people go “oh the record label probably made them do that”, but no, nobody made us do that, we just wanted to go in that direction ourselves. I don’t like to listen to other people’s opinions, we just do what we want to do, we’re the ones that have to play it!"
You’ve notably changed your image, and we noticed some stylistic differences as you delved head-first into a darker, heavier sound in your new album, but how would you describe your “aesthetic”, so to speak?
H: "As a band, it’s only recently that our look has gotten more cohesive. I feel like mine and Ciara’s aesthetic was very similar for a long time, but the boys’ aesthetic was drastically different to ours. And in a way, it complimented that. But only recently, I feel like we work collectively as a four piece in terms of fashion and aesthetic. That was really important to me, especially on this album, I really wanted to bring in a more chic image, and I think we’re going to continue to push that. My fashion sense has always been quite dramatic and dark. I don’t really love colour. As the years have gone by, I have become more feminine so that’s definitely impacted my fashion sense as well."
"I really wanted to bring in a more chic image"
Where are you most looking forward to playing on the upcoming tour?
H: "I’m excited to go to Japan, we’ve not been there for a few years. I’ve been there twice before, but I think it’s really cool we can go so far away from home and people are still going to show up."
What are you most looking forward to playing on tour? Do you have any particular songs you always look forward to when you’re playing a set, either from the new album or the older material?
H: "Maybe it’s because I’m quite biased, I really look forward to playing ‘You’re So Vain’. We’ve only recently started playing it. I love playing ‘Jealousy’ - we all love playing ‘Jealousy’ - we always look forward to that moment. I love playing ‘She’s My Religion’, that one is such a moment for everyone. The crowd really just engages and it feels like they’ve been waiting the entire time to hear it. I do love playing things like ‘TV Romance’ from the first album too."
You mentioned 'She's My Religion' - as a band, Pale Waves very open about LGBTQ+ issues/identities, but how would you feel about being labelled as a “queer band”? Do you think there are issues surrounding being almost “branded” as a queer band, or is it purely a positive thing in terms of representation?
H: "I definitely feel like it’s a good thing! I mean, we are that, so why would we not try and embrace that. But I do feel like even though we do a lot for the LGBTQ+ community, in general there are a lot of people in the community who don’t embrace us as much. I don’t know why, when we literally have a song called ‘She’s My Religion’. So yeah, we are embracing it, but we’re waiting for people to fully embrace us too. But I don’t think it’s a bad thing at all, I feel like we need the representation, because there isn’t a lot. And it’s what we are, we are queer. Well, 50% of the band are. The boys definitely aren’t."
"We are embracing [being labelled a queer band], but we're waiting for people to fully embrace us too"
How does it feel to be providing representation? Do you feel that you are if you’re not necessarily being embraced?
H: "No, we are [embraced], in a way. But we should be more embraced than we are being. You know, Gay Times, they really embrace us, they put us on the front cover and stuff. Maybe it’s because we only have a few songs that are queer. But it’s like, why, when we’re such advocates for that community? I think it’s really sweet we can create this safe space for people to come to a show and just be themselves, and not feel judged. They can just be who they truly are. I feel like, if you are a Pale Waves fan, you’re going to have similar interests or have something similar to the other people that are going to that show, inevitably. Don’t get me wrong, there are a few characters that come to a Pale Waves show and I’m like “hm that’s interesting”, but the majority of people are very similar."
(Lucy: "To be fair, my dad loves Pale Waves")
"Aw, thats so sweet! We do have a lot of dads come to our shows, it’s quite cute really."
Have you had any ideas about your plans for album number 4? What can we expect more or less of?
H: "I had a call with our label a few days ago and they want us to start writing and recording as early as next year. So there’s definitely going to be a new album next year at some point, which is quite daunting because I’ll need to crack on with that as soon as possible. But I’m just figuring out what kind of sound and what kind of world I want that album to be. It’s in the works, but we’re still early days."
Is there anything else you’d like to add?
H: "Not really, just our UK show dates! There are a few sold out already."
(Rowan: "Of course, I am really looking forward to the Newcastle show.")
"Oh, are you coming to Newcastle? Cute, I’ll try and come say hello!"
Pale Waves are playing Newcastle's Central Park on the 24th November. Tickets can be found here.